Backstage with Richard Ridge: Cash In with JUNK Leading Man- Steven Pasquale!

Welcome to Backstage with Richard Ridge

My guest is one of the entertainment industry's most sought-after leading men, Stephen Pasquale

who works effortlessly between stage, screen, and television. And now he is back on Broadway

in Pulitzer Prize-winning playwright Ayyad Akhtar's critically acclaimed new play, Junk. And we caught up with Stephen here in his dressing room

at Lincoln Center. So once again, thank you so much for sitting with me

Thank you. Thank you for sitting with me. And here are your dressing room here at the Vivian Beaumont

Here we are at the Beaumont, one of the great playing spaces in all the world, I would argue

And Lincoln Center famously has the best dressing rooms in New York, so we're super lucky

I love how this is all set up. Yeah, this is my, I'm putting my craft mask on

My lamp wasn't tall enough, so I just stole a bunch of books from somebody, Rick Holmes

And, you know, so now my lamp is tall enough. Well, your room is set up really nice in New York

Thank you very much. Thank you. Like I was telling you, you were extraordinary in this show. Thank you

What's it like living in the world that Ayad has put together, living in a high-risk, jump-on world of the 1980s

I think, just to talk a little bit about what it's like to be around Ayad as a writer

I say the only other thing I can compare it to is being around Tony Kushner

where the intellect is so impressive that the air in the room just feels a little, like, lifted

And you just want him to talk about stuff so that you can learn. and he takes that approach into his player rating

What he's done with junk is tackle, for my money, the great untold story of America

which is when absolutely unfettered, unregulated, raw American capitalism took hold in the 1980s

and a handful of guys, namely Mike Milken, who's a real guy, started corporate rating

and buying companies with debt and using incredibly high risk, questionable practices

to not just get rich, but to change the climate of how finance works at all

And to write a play about that seems really hard, and he's done an extraordinarily

it's quite an accomplishment to see what he's done with this play. The evening is, as I'm sure you know, it plays like a thriller

even though it's largely about real people and the effect of these incredible financial practices

and what it has on them. Did you do some kind of research

Did you know about this time period? I'm not a super savvy finance mind

It's all common sense to me. So my system of beliefs is like, why would they do this if they could do this

And so I had to learn a lot about it. But, you know, Den of Thieves

Oh, yeah. Which is a Pulitzer Prize winning book. It captures it incredibly so does the unwinding barbarians at the gate

Predator's Ball Makers and Takers to learn about what happened to American capitalism in the 80s

and where we are now is to open your eyes really wide

in terms of how we do things in this country Talk about the man that you play

Robert Murkier What makes him so fascinating to play? Well he's a

in one of the books he's loosely based on Mike Milken who's a real guy

so we don't want to mislead anybody into thinking it's a play about an actual guy

it's loosely based on him and people in his life and loosely based on events that took place in the 1980s regarding

corporate reading. But he, you know, he was like a once every 500 years kind of mind. That's what

that's how people described him. Not even generational, but like, you know, every century

or something, you'd get a mind like this guy who was able to see through the cracks of a system

and change the global economy with his system of beliefs. Now, you know, a man's folly and our nature in terms of excess and greed ultimately brought him down

But, I don't know, would you go to jail for two or three years if you could walk away with two and a half billion

I think I would. Yeah, I would too. That's the question. There you go. So, I mean, it's really interesting

You know, there are people that think he's a hero in terms of how he changed how we do things in finance

And then there are those who think of him as a rule-breaker and a law-breaker, and he should have spent his entire life in jail

And the play is not an indictment on anyone or anything. It is an examination of what we love and what we worship in America

and it asks you to draw your own conclusions. Because I love that when you're watching the other people talk, you're like

oh, now I agree with him. Oh, it's so smart, right? well that's Ayad's

accomplishment with the play it's so easy to dismiss certain characters as bad guys

or good guys but that's not the world we live in it's not what these guys were and the most brilliant thing

I'm experiencing in the play is feeling the audience's ambivalence about Robert Merkin

they are either literally clapping and rooting for him or disgusted by his behavior

and to sort of feel that tension with them every night is like one of the great

thrills I've experienced on stage but it switches for us as an audience member too because I like I hate you in that scene And I like yeah but I wish I had what he has to do what he does let be specific about it mike mike milken was a jew a lot of the guys that worked at uh drexel burnham were jews yeah and classic new york

banking are waspy white shoe uh... there's there's not more than a touch of anti-semitism in that

culture in the 1980s and so it's hard to not root for him and his band of guys and you want them to

achieve and to win. But then the common sense part of your brain kicks in and you think

yeah, but he's also doing all these other things and breaking the law. It's wildly complicated

It's tribal. It's an examination of our history in terms of finance. And it really says there are

no heroes, only flawed humans. You know, not only are you working with one

of the finest playwrights, you're also working with one of the greatest stage directors with Doug Hughes

Doug is just like first ballot Hall of Fame director for my money when all is said and done and i think he's uh done something with this play

that i think uh will be one of the great things that people think about when when they talk about

his legacy and the body of work that he will end up leaving um when all is said and done he's so

bright and a great leader and fearless with the with the playwright who uh you know their

conversations very much inform what A. Ed has written. And I'm sure I speak for A. Ed when I

say he couldn't and wouldn't have done it without Doug. Doug was essential in the process

So I was going to ask you, what was your collaboration like, like being in that rehearsal room as rewrites were being done and everything else

It's like thrilling. It's, you know, to have two world-class minds watching every moment

and getting your feedback and noting concerns and changing things and rewriting things to

make sure every single word that's written in this 175 page script is essential in moving the

story forward and there's no fluff there's no you know excess it's just story hitting you in the

face the whole time uh it was like one of the great thrills uh i've experienced in a rehearsal

room it was entirely collaborative at at every turn and then the cast what an incredible cast

you work with. Worst. Oh, the cast. No, they're amazing. Are you kidding

Rick Holmes. Yeah. Michael Sibiri, Miriam Silverman, and, oh my God, there's so many of them

I couldn't do them all, but it's an extraordinary, it's a world-class company of actors that has gathered

to tell this really important story. What do you remember about that first performance

on stage of Junk here at the Vivian Beaumont? Well, you know

the play is written like music in that it comes by, it goes by very quickly

And so the process of committing the play to memory is ten times more challenging than any other play I've ever done

In that if you have even the slightest millisecond of a hitch or a hesitant or a thought, the play leaves you behind for a little bit

And then it takes you a while to sort of get back on the train. And so the first few performances were us really just allowing ourselves to feel confident in the notion that we knew the play

You know what I mean? And then, of course, you start to get into day four, day five, week two, and then it starts to feel really fun because the music that he's written, we hear it without worrying so much about it

Yeah, because I see your script is out. Always, yeah. On your table. Yeah, it's intensely wordy

And if I don't take a little look at it every couple of days, I worry just about having a senior moment on stage and just have everyone be like, what's Steve Lutzwell doing right now

well that's it, he retired tonight he had a breakdown on stage and no one ever saw him again

you know speaking about that I ask everybody have you ever gone to the white room which they call it

when you go up not good I haven't, I haven't but I have had the panic of like

I don't know what comes next and there it is like it just is the magic of being an actor

sometimes it's just the gods smile on you and bail you out but I've had many moments of like

I don't know what comes next my brain just went, I'm talking anyway

it's a very strange thing don't get into this racket. It's really for the particularly crazy people

No, totally. Because I've asked everybody that. The whole Hamilton cast has finally gone up. Oh, sure

I'm certain of it. I'm certain of it. Yeah. In a musical, it's really hard because then, you know

in the music, you're like, oh my God. Yeah. So that's dangerous. Is it easier doing a play

than it is a musical or is it a different mindset? It's easier in terms of maintenance

Okay. In terms of taking care of your body and your instrument. It's maybe harder in that

you don't have the music to rely on. you know, and if you have a Jason Robert Brown score, for example, that evening was about

people just like being swept away by that incredible score. So I always felt like all I had to do was honor that. Without that, you know, you're left to your own devices

The playwright's words, what you came up with in the rehearsal room and how you play the scenes, which is much more vulnerable, but equally fulfilling without question

Yeah. You know, you've also gotten to do one of your dream roles, which of course was Billy

Bigelow in Carousel with Laura Osnes. In Chicago, yeah. Yeah. The lyric opera

Yeah. One of a great, like, soulful experience. I didn't know that. People always tell me I should play that part, but I didn't know that show

I just knew a couple of those songs. And so I really got to know that material for the first time in Chicago And I found it really soulful I think Carousel is a masterpiece and I think it a perfectly written American musical

and I don't think there are very many you can say that about. It's just absolutely without flaw

See, that was a no-brainer. I thought that was something you always wanted to do, that role. Yeah, I mean, it was, you know, I think the challenge with that show is always finding a..

The singing is so difficult, it's hard to find a good actor to handle the singing

And so I think that when Rob Ashford directed that production, he called me and said, I really think you'd be good in this

I was like, geez, I mean, it's a lot of high singing, man. That's pretty up. He said, just come

And we had a great time. It was really soulful, I think, across the board for all of us

She's gonna be sheltered in bed and dressed in the last that money can buy

I never knew how to make money But I'll try, my God, I'll try

I'll go out and make it Or steal it Or take it

Or adore You also got to do John Wilkes Booth

at Encore's Assassins. Brilliant production of that. Fondest memory. That was quick

I think Assassins is another one that now would qualify as a perfectly written musical. I know it's one of Steve's faves

that he wrote, as well as John Whiteman. And once you really get inside that thing

You see how brilliant it is. And it's never been more timely

And that was an incredible experience. I actually think the Life of Assassin's

should come back and be with us for a little while. People need to be around that show. It's that smart

I'll tell my soul if you must Let my body turn to dust

Let it linger in the ashes of the country Let them curse me to hell

Leave it to history to tell What I did, I did well

And I did it for my country Let them cry, dirty traitor

They will understand it later The country is not what it was

We have a lot of young actors who will be watching this

who are just starting their careers here in New York. Yes. When you first got to New York, you couldn't book a job, could you

I went out on the road when I graduated high school, and I spent four years on tour when everyone else was in college

and came to the city with, like, money I had saved in the bank

for being on tour and a whole lot of confidence. And I spent 18 months auditioning for every damn thing in town

and didn't book a single thing, a year and a half. And then six months after that, I had done a small job

but had another little phase of, like, not doing anything. And I thought, well, maybe this is just harder than I thought it was going to be

and then Dan Sullivan cast me in a play at Lincoln Center called Spinning Into Butter

which happened right downstairs. And my life as an actress really started in that moment

so I'll always be grateful to him for that. Did you ever have a down moment when you said

why am I staying in this business during those down times? You always wanted to do this, right

I can't do anything else. Are you kidding me? I'd be terrible at everything other than this

I love it. I mean, God, I can't imagine how bad I would be at anything else

I want to talk about your CD. I'm obsessed with your CD. Oh, you're so nice. I'm going to make another

Okay. Yeah, I think Pizzarelli and I are going to do a record called Voice and Guitar

so it's just him playing some beautiful old standards and me singing

So it'll just be like a really simple and sweet kind of Ella Fitzgerald Joe Pass. I love that

Yeah, cool, right? Because something like Love, I Clean My House to Your CD

Oh, I'm so glad, man. Thank you. It calms you down. It's this beautiful jazz CD

Yeah, I never really listen to super up-tempo stuff. I like a sort of mid-tempo, relaxed album

How did you choose the material? Just songs I loved. Just standards I loved

The Ladies in Love With You. Ladies in Love With You. We Smell Hours in the Morning. I mean, yeah, some great ones

Funny Valentine, of course. Yeah, I think we'll get a little bit more obscure with the next record

But you never took professional voice lessons, did you? I never did. Self-taught

In my car, listening to Billy Joel, Donny Hathaway. Wow. Stevie Wonder

And then eventually, pound for pound, maybe the greatest legit theater singer in the world, Anthony Warlow

Yeah. I don't think there'll ever be a voice that great Anthony Warlow

in his prime oh I love him he did Annie on Broadway oh right yes of course great guy he played all the really difficult singing roles in Australia Nobody really knew of him and I Will Chase actually gave me his album when I was like 20 and I remember thinking

well, that's the most impossibly perfect singing voice I've ever heard. So that became

a sort of teaching tool. So you could just mimic, right? Yeah, I'm a pretty good mimic

That's what it is. It's all fake. It's not even real. You also teach

a master class. I do. For actors, but it's on a different angle. Tell our audience

I teach a, I teach a, I teach a, a grad acting class at the NYU grad program called the real life of acting

where we do not talk about process or what's precious about it or what they've learned in

conservatory. We talk about what it is like to actually just be an actor in the world after

graduation. So things like, this is how you read a call sheet because they're wildly confusing

These are the people that you meet when you get to a television set for your first day ever of

work. And there's 90 people around. You don't know who anyone is. Uh, we practice hitting our marks

because every time you see a television show, you've got to hit your mark so the camera can find you, and you don't want to be an actor who says, like

Hey, I'm going to start this scene with you, but let me just look down here before I start talking to you. It's like a stupid thing, but you have to practice so that you don't look like an idiot

It just sort of becomes this great, soulful moment of these, like, brilliant and passionate young actors

just wanting to soak up knowledge, you know, from an old fart like me

But that's, like, the best thing to learn, because people can act in sync. Yeah, we don't really teach that in our conservatories

it's something that's lacking which is why I wanted to do it in the first place and it's been really successful

and I think I may do it in a bunch of other places actually you know it's fun

we talk about the size of we talk about performance size whether it's a wide shot

if you're on a television show or a film or a medium shot or a tight shot what that means in terms of what you should do with your performance

or the size of your voice etc and they catch on so quick

those kids are some of the best young actors on planet earth So it's a great program to be a part of

Great. Now upcoming for you is season two of HBO's Divorce? Correct

Is there anything you can tell us on that? I don't know

I mean, maybe I'm not allowed. You can kill me. I play her like, you know

I think I play like maybe the first attempt she has at sort of like being with somebody who's not

you know, Thomas Hayden Church. Totally. Yeah. And she's the most fun

Sarah Descarver is a blast to be around. I will say that much. So have you started filming

We filmed it, oh my God, six months ago. Okay, so you can't tell? All right, I'm just saying you really can't tell

That's why my face went, because it was so long ago. Oh, right, that's done. But you're going to be on season two of Divorce

Yeah, I think we're just happening soon. If you could sum up the best part of the experience so far

with being in junk and being back here at Lincoln Center, what is it for you, Stephen

Well, my first job in New York was at Lincoln Center, so it feels like a homecoming of sorts

Also, I was in a new house, so it took me 20 years to get upstairs to the Beaumont. To the big house

18 years. I can't round up. I think it's one of the great playing spaces in the world

The Beaumont is one of the great houses that the world has to offer. I think what Andre Bishop has done with Lincoln Center

has made it one of the most essential arts theater institutes on planet Earth

I think it's the closest thing we have to a national theater in the United States

I think Doug has assembled a world-class crew of incredible actors. I think Ayad Akhtar is a Bach-Beethoven caliber playwright when he is all said and done

So I'm trying to just live in every moment and appreciate what this project is for me

What's the last thing you do before you hit the stage here in Junk? Push-ups

Just got to get the blood flowing a little bit. It takes any other sort of distractions out of the picture

Beautiful. My final question is, what is the best bit of advice that you've been given, either personally or professionally, by Lippa

I auditioned for a show that I didn't get when I was very young, and I found myself in Harry Connick Jr.'s circle

He would never even remember this, I'll bet, but I hope he sees it. And I was sort of sad about it

He said, just let your talent guide you. He said, just keep doing what you do, and just let your talent guide you

and I promise you, everything will be okay. But you have to have the faith in your own talent

I remember thinking, all right, I'm just going to try that. And it was really, you know, 15 years later, it's sound advice

That's perfect. I thank you so much. Thank you, man. You are the best at what you do, my friend

Thank you, sir. Thank you for opening your dressing room. I really appreciate it